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      ICE OR HEAT TO TREAT BACK PAIN?
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      TOPIC: ICE OR HEAT TO TREAT BACK PAIN?

      Re: ICE OR HEAT TO TREAT BACK PAIN? 3 years, 5 months ago #28960

      • Cavitator
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      By the way, the depth of penetration for external heat or ice is only like 5 mm, from what I recall, so the argument is really an academic one. You are only heating/cooling the skin and the very most superficial tissues with either
      3/51 Bilateral VIII C.N. complete neurectomy
      2/60 Failed Supratentorial electrotherapy w/subsequent pancerebral resection
      2/89 Bilateral aqueous humor drainage w/complete retinectomy
      3/02 Quadralateral proximal extremity resection from gestational thalidomide exposure
      Last Edit: 3 years, 5 months ago by Cavitator.

      Re: ICE OR HEAT TO TREAT BACK PAIN? 3 years, 5 months ago #28961

      • ljansen
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      When it comes to the ice/heat argument, you'll get a different response depending on who you talk to. Generally, if their is swelling, heat is ill-advised as it creates vasoconstriction and promotes 'fluid stasis' as cav described. Ice is a vasodilator, however after 12 minutes of icing, blood vessels will actually vasoconstrict (this is the reasoning behind the suggested method of ice 10 mins on 10 mins off after an injury to prevent this effect that would increase swelling after the 12 mins...I can't remember the name of this effect for the life of me, university physiology/sports med was a long time ago). The best way to reduce swelling/fluid stasis is elevation above the heart and for areas where this is more difficult, exercise is also very important as muscle contraction/movement provides a 'pump effect'. Cav is also right in terms of icing and it's superficial effects, if you have access to something like game ready, the compression does allow the cold to penetrate deeper then just 'slapping on some ice'.

      The ice/heat debate will continue amongst academic fields for years to come tho...
      R. Shoulder Capsular Shift - Sept. 03
      L. Shoulder Bankart/SLAP/Capsular Shift/Rotator interval & SS repair - Jan. 05
      L. Shoulder MUA/adhesion release - Jan. 06
      L. Shoulder SAD/Bursectomy - Sept. 07
      L. Shoulder Biceps Tenodesis - Mar. 09
      L. Shoulder Open Latarjet & Arthroscopy - Nov. 24, 2011
      L. Shoulder Capsular Release/SAD - June 11, 2012
      L. Shoulder Capsular Release/Screw Removal/Biceps Tenotomy - Mar. 22, 2013
      L. Shoulder Arthroscopic Latarjet Screw Removal, Interval Repair, Axillary Neurolysis, Debridement

      Re: ICE OR HEAT TO TREAT BACK PAIN? 3 years, 5 months ago #28962

      • riderk
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      Putting aside academic debate and treatment effects, i use either depending on what i am feeling. If neither is going to "heal" tissue after a certain point, and neither is overdone to the point of injuring the skin, both can be quite useful for pain relief. Sometimes i want ice and sometimes heat feels better.

      Re: ICE OR HEAT TO TREAT BACK PAIN? 3 years, 5 months ago #28965

      • Cavitator
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      ljansen wrote:
      ....would increase swelling after the 12 mins...I can't remember the name of this effect for the life of me,


      Huntington reaction. Thanks Riderk....I agree....ice is my friend too (as is a hot shower)!

      The insurance companies agree that heat or ice only "feels good" as they stopped paying for in-office application of external heat/ice packs years ago (not deemed as able to "cure or relieve the effects of disease") but there is sound explanation for heat/ice's ability to attenuate pain levels.
      3/51 Bilateral VIII C.N. complete neurectomy
      2/60 Failed Supratentorial electrotherapy w/subsequent pancerebral resection
      2/89 Bilateral aqueous humor drainage w/complete retinectomy
      3/02 Quadralateral proximal extremity resection from gestational thalidomide exposure
      Last Edit: 3 years, 5 months ago by Cavitator.

      Re: ICE OR HEAT TO TREAT BACK PAIN? 3 years, 5 months ago #28966

      • ljansen
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      Huntington reaction! That's it! I don't know why I was going to say Thompson and then realized that is achilles test. All of my knowledge is slowly seeping away...
      R. Shoulder Capsular Shift - Sept. 03
      L. Shoulder Bankart/SLAP/Capsular Shift/Rotator interval & SS repair - Jan. 05
      L. Shoulder MUA/adhesion release - Jan. 06
      L. Shoulder SAD/Bursectomy - Sept. 07
      L. Shoulder Biceps Tenodesis - Mar. 09
      L. Shoulder Open Latarjet & Arthroscopy - Nov. 24, 2011
      L. Shoulder Capsular Release/SAD - June 11, 2012
      L. Shoulder Capsular Release/Screw Removal/Biceps Tenotomy - Mar. 22, 2013
      L. Shoulder Arthroscopic Latarjet Screw Removal, Interval Repair, Axillary Neurolysis, Debridement

      Re: ICE OR HEAT TO TREAT BACK PAIN? 3 years, 5 months ago #28981

      • OConnell
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      Lots of interesting responses. Way to go Cavitator. Generally speaking heat and cold follow the same nerve that senses temperature, so they basically control pain the same way by flooding the pathways and blocking pain that travels on a smaller nerve fiber. Heat is good for relaxing muscles, ice is better for reducing inflamation.
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